HI - What a mother will do for her son!!!!

[Bully]

Originally Posted by adodds1072

ms jones seams to know what she is doing with regards to water testing, no one has yet asked how far in to the cycle it has been.

See my first response to this post:

Originally Posted by Bully

At what stage are you with your fishless cycle?

and, the answer:

Originally Posted by manningjones

.....and I have completed the three day bio - loading additions and I was told to then leave the tank for one week before adding fish.

This information leads me to the conclusion that no external ammonia source has been added to the tank. This is the reason why the test results appear fine. It in no way suggests that the tank has been cycled and has sufficient bacteria present to deal with fish.

Originally Posted by adodds1072

...adding a small fish into a large tank, that is well monitiored and maintained shouldnt be a problem and will only speed up the cycle process due the orangic waste and gut bacteria from actually having a fish in the tank. she has said the tank is already planted again adding more organic waste.

We never advocate cycling a tank with fish on this forum. Neither does the magazine.

[hedge]

Welcome to the forum, as you may be feeling now, people on here have strong feelings towards whats best for the fish.

Many people find themselves here after getting what is widely felt across these forums bad advice from their local fish shop. The biggest issue felt here is that there is no such thing as an easy cycle. Non of the products sold by the fish shops are felt to be good enough to allow the fish keeper to add fish within lets say a week.

There is no denying the nitrogen cycle, this is the process of converting ammonia to nitrate (with an a). The bacteria required to perform this task take weeks to develop. The bordom of staring at test tubes telling you that yet again your ammonia is high and you still have no sign of nitrites (with an i) can only be countered by the knowledge that once you finish the cycle the fish you then buy won't have to sufffer through this period.

There are however a number of useful techniques that you can learn through the fishless cycle.

1) Accurate water testing, understanding how the test kits really work
2) Water changes. There is more to this than meets the eye. I have a small 45 litre tank and so I am lucky as I can do a 25-30% water change with just 2 buckets, one for waste and one for top up. Larger tanks require a little more thought. Also understand your gravel vaccum, this tool takes a bit of getting used to so practice without fish. Understanding how to properly vac your tank is a top priority - I am still learning.
3) How your equipment works. From the filter to the pump to the heaters getting used to them before adding fish helps. Do your timers all work OK, have you got the correct filter media?
4) Research. Is your tank set up good? I started with way to much sand which could lead to poisining the water. I had far to few plants which initially lead to stresssed fish and fry getting eaten.

Its kind of tough love and as you have not added fish yet then the people here simply want to make sure your armed with the knowledge that a fishless cycle is less harmful to fish than a fish in cycle.

Good luck what ever you decide.

A newbie.

[veezee]

Originally Posted by hedge

Welcome to the forum, as you may be feeling now, people on here have strong feelings towards whats best for the fish.

Many people find themselves here after getting what is widely felt across these forums bad advice from their local fish shop. The biggest issue felt here is that there is no such thing as an easy cycle. Non of the products sold by the fish shops are felt to be good enough to allow the fish keeper to add fish within lets say a week.

There is no denying the nitrogen cycle, this is the process of converting ammonia to nitrate (with an a). The bacteria required to perform this task take weeks to develop. The bordom of staring at test tubes telling you that yet again your ammonia is high and you still have no sign of nitrites (with an i) can only be countered by the knowledge that once you finish the cycle the fish you then buy won't have to sufffer through this period.

There are however a number of useful techniques that you can learn through the fishless cycle.

1) Accurate water testing, understanding how the test kits really work
2) Water changes. There is more to this than meets the eye. I have a small 45 litre tank and so I am lucky as I can do a 25-30% water change with just 2 buckets, one for waste and one for top up. Larger tanks require a little more thought. Also understand your gravel vaccum, this tool takes a bit of getting used to so practice without fish. Understanding how to properly vac your tank is a top priority - I am still learning.
3) How your equipment works. From the filter to the pump to the heaters getting used to them before adding fish helps. Do your timers all work OK, have you got the correct filter media?
4) Research. Is your tank set up good? I started with way to much sand which could lead to poisining the water. I had far to few plants which initially lead to stresssed fish and fry getting eaten.

Its kind of tough love and as you have not added fish yet then the people here simply want to make sure your armed with the knowledge that a fishless cycle is less harmful to fish than a fish in cycle.

Good luck what ever you decide.

A newbie.

This man (?) talks sense.

The utmost responsibility to you as an owner of any living thing is it's safety and welfare. Fish-in cycles are undeniably detrimental to the health of the fish, and that is why the feeling of hostility towards this technique can sometimes be seen on this forum.

None of us will criticise you for seeking advice, and I'm personally glad so many people do seek information outside of the local shop.

My newest tank is cycling at present. I've had it just over 4 weeks, and as the readings aren't yet 100% spot on, I haven't even considered what fish to keep yet.

[manningjones]

Thanks for your tips, I got some gouramis and they have settled in really well - infact I have a nest already! The bigger male built and it was so interesting to watch - the female seemed more keen to shed her eggs and the male kept nudging her away so that he could finish his work of art!
The fish store was so chocker - block with customers when I visited last week that I left without my further test kits, however I will go tomorrow as I am not working - so it will be quieter and I can discuss everything with the helpful guys then - I'll forward some results then to you if you are still interested.

What are 'rainbow fish like? any views? I saw some red/ silver fish in my local .....

Laura

[Yardbent]

Originally Posted by manningjones

Thanks for your tips,
I got some gouramis and they have settled in really well - ...........
I visited last week that I left without my further test kits,
Laura

- if you are on about day4 .............it will take about 4weeks to "cycle" the filter with bacteria which convert the toxic ammonia to toxic nitrite then to nitrates - which the plants use and you keep to about 15-29ppm by doing 25% waterchanges weekly

and

As mentioned by Yardbent and Paula (and myself (Bully)previously) do not add fish at this point, nor in the very near future.


did you miss this by any chance ?.........